Author Topic: Techniques for improving one's involvement with non-occult organizations?  (Read 238 times)


I find myself presently in a category of situation that I have hitherto mostly avoided: I participate, presently as a lower-ranking member due to having joined relatively recently, in a volunteer non-occult organization with the usual array of dysfunctions endemic to such groups. The oddity of the situation is that the benefits that I attain from continuing to participate outweigh the benefits of stepping away from it. The particular benefits include access to tools and locations that non-members are denied, and these things are sufficiently large and expensive that it is not worth my while to obtain my own copies nor to relocate far enough to try a different instance of a similar volunteer group.

For a sense of scale, my main complaints about these leaders' behavior involve their failure to communicate complete information, in circumstances where proceeding with the incomplete (but allegedly sufficient) information causes followers to make mistakes which could only have been prevented using the knowledge the leaders withheld. The leaders would excuse this oversight as having been "too busy" to communicate fully if pressed about it, yet I see no attempts from them to delegate any parts of the tasks which consumed the time they might otherwise have dedicated to an adequate explanation. I have exhausted all available avenues for addressing this problem through self-change (short of leaving the group entirely or attempting to take it over, neither of which meets my needs at this point), so now I resort to considering the prospect of attempting to change others.

I generally stay out of attempting to control others' behavior, but this situation is such that I'd be willing to gently nudge leadership toward acting less incompetently (or at least toward communicating better!). I'm consoled somewhat by the fact that the desired effects should be attainable with ordinary tact and psychology -- no "magic" required.

I appreciate that a worst-case scenario of meddling here would involve my having to take on all of the problem individuals' responsibilities, and while that obviously isn't my goal, it's a risk I find it worth taking in order to improve the quality of my involvement with the group.

I ask here because within the volunteer group, I appear to be alone in considering the chronically poor communication an intolerable state of affairs. Non-occultists in the group appear happy to blame their own flaws for problems caused by leadership's poor communication -- "well I should have known better" - and to tolerate the repetition of communication problems as an inevitable fact of participation. I appear to be unusual in my insistence on changing whatever personal flaws contribute to failure, and thus reaching the conclusion that some issues encountered within the group appear intractable through change by only one participant. However, this forum is full of individuals who I expect may share my high standards for personal performance/treatment/improvement/interaction-with-the-outside-world, and who thus seem likely to have addressed similar challenges to this one in the past.

My question to you, lovely forum denizens, is: Have you used your powers to tweak your direct leaders' behavioral habits? What habits have you found easiest to change in them; are some traits especially difficult to alter? And what such changes brought forth the greatest improvements to your ability to act autonomously where their oversights may have hindered you before?


Not really able to contribute much experience to this, sorry - it's only been 6 month that I even have a boss that would have any influence on me large enough to even consider it necessary to make any changes.

With my boss, one thing that I'm learning now is that how easy it is to convince him of something does not necessarily depend on the arguments, but often also on whether they are presented to him in a manner he quickly and easily understands. And people may differ in what they understand most easily.
Possibly approaching it from that angle might also apply to your situation - especially considering your leaders claiming to be very busy.

With other "bosses" of mine, i.e. admins on websites I moderated, mentioning some issue often enough also tends to do the trick, but I can take a while, and you might want to avoid it if you aren't sure whether they value you enough for not minding getting bothered by you (luckily that wasn't the problem in my cases).
« Last Edit: October 01, 2018, 06:33:19 pm by Liu »


I'm reminded of @Deidre's predicament but this leader seems adept and might be a different story.
"Some say Kos, others Kosm.
As you did for the vacuous Rom,
grant us eyes.
Grant us eyes."

-Micolash, Host of the Nightmare


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Alright, homie, so I'm going to try and frame this in a way that includes some LHP as well as non-occult things. So, first and I feel most importantly is that people who walk the LHP, whatever flavor, have accepted one general truth: we are masters of our own world. We can shape and influence what is around us through words and actions. So how do you solve the problem of inept leadership? Take the reins. Influence using words of those in superior positions is a stepped approach. Don't embarrass leaders or call out mistakes in front of your group. This only paints a target on you to either be removed from the situation or, less likely, cause someone to promote you to leadership (which you may not want). Approach your leaders in private with clear, recent examples of their shortcomings and what they could have done better to prevent any mistakes their ineptitude may have caused. Do this at least twice, but I'm of the mind that three strikes is ample opportunity.

So let's say they don't pick up what you're putting down. You should next approach their direct superior. Keep the examples you raised before noted plus any new situations that have come up since you spoke to your leader. If your superior gets mad that your jumped the chain on them, remind them politely that you already spoke to them privately and directly but didn't see results. This move is going to be seen as a threat to their standing, so expect possible repercussions from your leader if they're insecure.

Last, and definitely a last resort, embarrass your leader. Make significant, noticeable, and preventable mistakes as often and loudly as possible. Make sure it can be attributed to poor leadership and not just to you acting like an idiot. This is a high-risk tactic, as excessive blunders would make you an easy target for dismissal sooner rather than later.

So now let me tie this into LHP. Note I'm an atheistic Luciferian, so I'm going to be tying this more to that flavor of LHP than anything else:

Magick, magic, magik or however else you want to spell it is imo non-sense. There are no rituals to make inept leaders suddenly do their jobs. There are no spells you can cast to turn your dunce bosses into geniuses and masters of efficiency and communication. You want to know what the real magic is? You. You are capable of doing everything you described. You put magic into the world with your words. If you have these conversations with your leaders, your words will have an effect on them that no ritual ever could. If they fail to change from your words, your actions of overriding their authority will set into motion the possibility of removing them from their position. And like "ritual magick", if your heart is not in it the ritual will backfire. Just like if you jump the chain and talk to your boss's boss: if you go in half-cocked without having taken the proper steps to do so, the higher leadership could see you as impertinent and impudent and they'll send you packing.

You are the master of your world. But don't let this make you arrogant: you can only control yourself; how others react to your actions cannot be. You can mold the actions, reactions, thoughts, ideas, and words of others with your own; but outright control is not possible. Make a plan, take notes of what goes on around you, use your words to plant seeds of change, and act accordingly to how the situation unfolds. You brain is all the magic you need!

*Edited for spelling/grammar.