Author Topic: Why a black candle? (and other questions)  (Read 608 times)

Olive

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #15 on: June 14, 2018, 05:20:50 pm »
But most commonly, I use and see planetary associations used. Saturn=black, Jupiter=blue, Mars=red, Sun=Yellow, Venus=Green, Mercury=Orange. Or you could do elemental, in which case green or black is often used for earth.

Just popping in to say - How could you list all other classical planets and leave out the Moon? For shame, Nemo!  ;)  I commonly use white candles to honor her, though other colors can sometimes be appropriate.

I have found over the years that planetary associations are much more potent than I originally gave them credit for when I started my practice. There really is very little difference between the ancient concepts of "Gods" and "Planets" when you get down to it. Here are the seven, in the Chaldean ordering of antiquity.

Saturn, Jupiter, Mars, The Sun, Venus, Mercury, and The Moon.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2018, 05:22:48 pm by Olive »
    Art thou pale for weariness
Of climbing heaven, and gazing on the earth,
     Wandering companionless
Among the stars that have a different birth, -
And ever-changing, like a joyless eye
That finds no object worth its constancy?

-Percy Bysshe Shelley

NEMO 93

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #16 on: June 14, 2018, 11:25:01 pm »
@Olive  D'oh. I feel ashamed, I'm working through 7 Spheres while adopting Hekate as matron deity(or vice-versa, you know how that thing goes) so it's definitely something I should remember. Especially since purple is my favorite color. White makes sense with moon although I often associate white with pure kether(then again black sometimes pulls double duty as saturn and kether for me too.) Maybe I should adopt Carrol's octarine as Kether, that's an idea. But I'm getting off topic.


Yes, I highly recommend planetary magick. That Planetary Squares are wonderful too, especially to create custom sigils with. It's super easy to do and has a lot of power built into them.

Liu

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2018, 09:28:25 am »
But most commonly, I use and see planetary associations used. Saturn=black, Jupiter=blue, Mars=red, Sun=Yellow, Venus=Green, Mercury=Orange. Or you could do elemental, in which case green or black is often used for earth.

Just popping in to say - How could you list all other classical planets and leave out the Moon? For shame, Nemo!  ;)  I commonly use white candles to honor her, though other colors can sometimes be appropriate.

I have found over the years that planetary associations are much more potent than I originally gave them credit for when I started my practice. There really is very little difference between the ancient concepts of "Gods" and "Planets" when you get down to it. Here are the seven, in the Chaldean ordering of antiquity.

Saturn, Jupiter, Mars, The Sun, Venus, Mercury, and The Moon.

I noticed it before but I never found an explanation: Why is the Chaldean order so obviously related to the order of the weekdays that correspond to the planets, but always skipping one day?
Perhaps you who are a bit more knowledgeable about planetary symbolism know?

I perhaps should delve more into the traditional associations, too. A while ago I developed a personal symbolism, based one the 7 planets (+ an additional one) in combination to the 8 colours of magick, and a lot of personal reinterpretations. Mainly using it atm for colour-coding my personal notes/goalsetting, but it has developed quite a bit from the original meanings.
I mean, relating Venus to the arts, Mars to sports and even Mercury to spirituality kinda are close to the original, but the rest are all over the place and perhaps I might currently benefit from moving that back closer to the tradition in order to make it easier for me to benefit from traditional correspondences etc.

Any recommendations where to start?

pi_rameses

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2018, 12:24:58 pm »
@Liu not sure about the Chaldean order.

In what other ways do you associate the other planetary bodies (Saturn, Jupiter, etc)?
Pro omnis dominos viae sinistra, sic itur ad astra

Setamontet

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #19 on: June 16, 2018, 02:06:36 pm »
Some interesting discussions here.  I've always used black candles during ritual workings, and have employed sigil magic.  Using black candles is purely symbolic (the Black Flame), and a reflection of myself as a Black Magician who embraces and works with the Powers of Darkness.  Black candles are visually pleasing with my two Anubis candle holders and they smell good too.  = )
« Last Edit: June 16, 2018, 02:19:42 pm by Setamontet »

"O learn the Law, my brothers of the night - the Great Law and the Lesser Law.
The Great Law brings the balance and doth persist without mercy.
The Lesser Law abideth as the key, and the Shining Trapezoid is the door!" - Anton LaVey

Liu

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #20 on: June 16, 2018, 06:00:55 pm »
@Liu not sure about the Chaldean order.

In what other ways do you associate the other planetary bodies (Saturn, Jupiter, etc)?
Currently:

Moon: theoretical knowledge/reading/language learning

Jupiter: health (plus things related to gender transitioning)

Saturn: organizing/job/household

Sun: practical knowledge/sciences

Eris: gaming, movies etc. (earlier I associated that one with arts)

Most went through a lot of meaning shifts, as you can guess (would have to look through my old notes which meanings I gave them earlier), and I mainly also didn't refer to them by their planetary names but had a bunch of other mythological characters that I associated with them, and now I only use the colours. Didn't take it far spiritually, though, as I said, mainly for journaling and things like that (even though that of course can have a huge spiritual component).

Olive

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #21 on: June 16, 2018, 07:47:42 pm »
Quote
I noticed it before but I never found an explanation: Why is the Chaldean order so obviously related to the order of the weekdays that correspond to the planets, but always skipping one day?
Perhaps you who are a bit more knowledgeable about planetary symbolism know?

Sure. The Babylonians and the successors of their traditions, who came to be known as the Chaldeans, constructed their ordering based on the relative distances to each of the celestials, from furthest to nearest. This was calculated from their relative speeds as they move through the sky. It is easiest to visualize this in the traditional geocentric planetary spheres model, which I have included several images of for reference.

They believed that the Seven Luminaries ruled over many things in the heaven and and the earth. For them, each hour was ruled by a specific planetos, and this rule was passed to the next in order once the hour was complete. If a planet ruled the first hour of the day, it was considered to preside over the entire day, despite the hourly change. (Meaning that thrice in 24 hour period, a Luminary rules over both the day and the hour, which is especially auspicious for planetary alignment in magical workings)

This means that 3 cycles of the 7 hours is completed every 21 hours. However, a day is 24 hours. And therefore the ruler of the next day was not the next planet in the Chaldean order, but was instead 3 removed. If you pass the Chaldean hourly order through an entire week, the planetary ruler of each day will produce the familiar days of the week in their accepted order, even to this day. (I'll include the French names as well because the English names are somewhat obscured by the substitution of Norse god names.)

The Sun, Sunday, Dimanche (Day of the Lord, indicating the Roman-Christian veneration of the Sun. Originally the Latin dies Sol )

The Moon, Monday, Lundi (dies Luna)

Mars, Tuesday (Tiw/Tyr's Day), Mardi (dies Martis)

Mercury, Wednesday (Woden/Odin's Day), Mercredi

Jupiter, Thursday (Thunor/Thor's Day), Jeudi

Venus, Friday (Friga/Freya's Day), Vendi

Saturn, Saturday, Samedi.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2018, 07:52:09 pm by Olive »
    Art thou pale for weariness
Of climbing heaven, and gazing on the earth,
     Wandering companionless
Among the stars that have a different birth, -
And ever-changing, like a joyless eye
That finds no object worth its constancy?

-Percy Bysshe Shelley

Deidre

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #22 on: June 17, 2018, 01:24:44 am »
Some interesting discussions here.  I've always used black candles during ritual workings, and have employed sigil magic.  Using black candles is purely symbolic (the Black Flame), and a reflection of myself as a Black Magician who embraces and works with the Powers of Darkness.  Black candles are visually pleasing with my two Anubis candle holders and they smell good too.  = )

Interesting. For my own clarity, how do you define powers of darkness for your rituals?
"Don't look for riches, look for rich experiences." - Lucian Black

pi_rameses

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2018, 02:02:07 am »
@Olive What a contrast: the first hour to signify the whole of the day (21h) v. the meridian or noon of the day (24h) in a work like the The Sacred Magic of Abra-Melin.

The former persists to this day whereas the latter suggests in their paradigm that any planet can rule in any day (undoubtedly this would not phase a chaos magician as much).
Pro omnis dominos viae sinistra, sic itur ad astra

pi_rameses

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #24 on: June 17, 2018, 02:08:39 am »
@Liu pretty spot on associations.

Regarding Saturn, I associate it with binding contracts. I suppose that is somehow synonymous with a work or organizational role.

I don't associate Eris with much of anything. I suppose I've merged most of those associations with Mercury. Nice addition.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2018, 02:12:06 am by pi_rameses »
Pro omnis dominos viae sinistra, sic itur ad astra

Liu

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #25 on: June 17, 2018, 07:27:31 am »
@Olive Thank you very much for the explanation! I didn't give planetary hours much attention thus far, and I didn't realize that idea is that old. That makes a lot of sense. So it's not about jumping ahead 2 but going back 4.

@Liu pretty spot on associations.

Regarding Saturn, I associate it with binding contracts. I suppose that is somehow synonymous with a work or organizational role.

I don't associate Eris with much of anything. I suppose I've merged most of those associations with Mercury. Nice addition.
After writing them down like that I realized that they currently are a bit closer to the traditional associations than I had had the impression. It's very much by chance, though, as I didn't really give the original names much thought. For example associating Jupiter with health and transitioning (which still seems a bit outlandish to me) came about because I associated that one with Leviathan (as the subconscious and therefore bridge between body and mind). Don't ask me how I decided on that, I think it had something to do with the Chinese element associated with Jupiter (which would be wood), but it was like 3 years ago.

I mainly included Eris as an eighth because I was (and still kinda am) also using this system for some kind of calendar based on 8 seasons (based on the equinoxes etc.). And because Discordia.

Deidre

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #26 on: June 17, 2018, 09:08:46 pm »
I've read a little of what you are all talking about, but I need to learn more. lol
"Don't look for riches, look for rich experiences." - Lucian Black

crossfire

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #27 on: June 18, 2018, 07:54:02 am »
I joined a spells forum today, and one of the banishing spells that I'm interested in requires a black candle. I'm just wondering the significance of that as compared to any other color, for such a spell?

Also, where do you buy your materials for your spells, rituals, etc?


Tibetan magick is by color.  Black magick is used to transform hatred into compassion.

You can get a good deal on black (or any other color) chime candles on Amazon.  Chime candles are just about the perfect size for a spell.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2018, 07:56:02 am by crossfire »
"Show me a sane man and I will cure him for you."
~Carl Jung

crossfire

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #28 on: June 18, 2018, 08:01:14 am »
I've been practicing chaos magick for about 4 or 5 years now? It's basically all ingrained into my brain as much as 2+2=4 is at this point but I always learn new stuff every day. I highly recommend Liber Null & Psychonaut for the basics of spells and rituals from there you can put together your own,

I also highly recommend Liber Null for the basics of trance induction.  Practice your four-fold breathing as described in Liber Null.  It is a handy skill to have which is useful over a wide spectrum of applications.
"Show me a sane man and I will cure him for you."
~Carl Jung

crossfire

Re: Why a black candle? (and other questions)
« Reply #29 on: June 18, 2018, 08:09:46 am »


Okay, that makes sense. There wasn't an explanation as to why a black candle is necessary. It also suggests banishing oil, I'm not sure where to buy this. I could also do the burning paper banishing spell with the black candle, this particular spell is a little more elaborate. I hesitate to do any spells that require too much from me just yet, as I'm new to this, and I've been reading about warnings, to be careful to not take on too much too soon. I don't want to do something to harm anyone, or myself. 

How did you learn about all of this? Did it take you a long time?
Anointing your candle with a scented oil helps to focus your intent.  (If you have ever experienced a flood of memories coming back to you upon smelling a certain scent, you'll get an idea of how this works.) 

Peppermint, rue, pepper, rosemary, and sulfur are good scents for a banishing oil.
"Show me a sane man and I will cure him for you."
~Carl Jung