Author Topic: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.  (Read 755 times)

NEMO 93

Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« on: September 15, 2017, 01:40:06 am »
Many dichotomies based on old myth are Christianized perspectives or Christian influenced perspectives interpreting something completely foriegn to that world view. I can point to various instances of ego disolution leading to self deification or at the very least being a tool you can apply to either path. This is esentially related to rebirth, not a cosmic level, but within yourself in your own life time.

The first I would mention would be Crowley's Thelema. It is obviously very focused on Ego disolution to the point that you most throw it away to cross the abyss. One of the Angels Crowley communicated with is recorded in a Thelemic Holy Book as intructing the way to enlightenment being to use both marriages. Thelema puts strong emphasis on Antinomianism both to separate yourself from your culture and your own ego but also to strengthen your own ego. Many interpret the HGA to be a perfect future self communicating with you from the now. This inherently implies that it still has a sense of self. It is a belief in Thelema that those who cross the abyss take their places as stars. This obviously invokes not only the "every man and woman is a star" but the solar myth of the Osirian cult. I know a lot of people on here are Temple of Set but there is evidence in the original myth that Set is not evil but just another force. In the conclusion of the myth, Horus and Set are given equal share of the land. If it was not for Set, Osiris never would have been deified. Set was also sometimes seen as the God of the foriegners. Osiris was the pharoah in the afterlife and Horus the pharoah in life. Through conflict and reconcilation adversity(Set), they would become deified. The stars mentioned by Crowley are simply deified. Thelemites also belive that they should embrace the material world as Nuit.

 This points me to Norse Myth feauturing Odin, Loki, and Raganorok. Much like Horus and Set, Odin and Loki can be seen as adversaries who share much in common in their behavior at times. I'd argue that Horus is a trickster deity to some extent if you read on his contests with Set.  Two of Odin's most distinguishable features are his many feats of self-sacrifice and his self deification. Odin was not born a God of wisdom. He had to earn it. He removed an eye to drink from a well of wisdom, hung from the tree sacrificing himself to himself to learn the rune work, and sacrificed his reputation to learn womanly magic. However, Odin did not choose to disolve into the all and came Ragnarok, he fought for the existence of the material world and his existence against the anti-cosmic ice gaints. Odin was not the originaly Cheiftan of the Aeisir. In fact, the Greco-Romans associated Odin with Hermes. He was esentially a Promethean Trickster God who's lust for knowledge strengthened himself to the All-Father. Odin has many roles and has somewhere around 50 names describing his various aspect. The moral in Odin's story is that sometimes to deify yourself, old selfs must be shed. This does not prevent self-deification but can help to accelerate it. This both discards your weakness but also allows you to play multiple roles such as Loki the shapeshifter who's various changes furthered his will and immersing yourself to master them. At the end of the day, Loki as the catalyst for change brings about Ragnarok and the world ends. However, any portral of a Revelations type event is the fault of Snorri's christian influences. The important part is the the world starts over anew. On both macrocosmic and microcosmic levels, disolution is not permanent. In fact, Helheim is much like normal life in mythology. It is simply a chance to begin anew.

For this practical use, I point to chaos magick paradigms. The best chaos magician to ever live, in my opinion, was David Bowie and he prepared for his death with a ritual that deified him into a Blackstar. See the aforementioned paragaph by Thelema. By learning to deconstruct himself and reconstruct himself by will alone, Bowie was able to self deify. This is the path of a chaos magician. To learn to play many roles in life as Odin did. It is not enough to simply play them but to master them. You can not master a role if you do not immerse yourself completely. Chaos Magick's greatest strength is not it's personal style or simplification but the true meaning of belief as a tool. Is there any better banishing then killing your identity as an occultist and learning to live as an Athiest and truly believing? In doing so, you see how you can latch on to negative traits. Intrusive thoughts, a need to believe in a higher power. You can kill the weakness that is not a master of your own reality. Once you have mastered your will as an atheist, you then completely kill that self and embrace a new identity. Play a rebel, a cynic, a romantic, a pagan, a atheist, a stoic, and so on. Peter J Carrol said the clearest view is from a pile of your dead selves. However, our examination of mythology shows that the end is not really the end. They still live on in some form. Once you have mastered these personalites, you are now in control of them. You have created your own panthenon of archetypes that only embody only your will without the baggage of external godforms to invoke and banish when useful. If David Bowie did succede in deifying himself as the Blackstar and we can evoke him as a Godhead, we can choose an aspect to invoke him as. Ziggy Stardust, The Thin White Duke, Major Tom, and so on. These are all authentically him but serve different purposes. The same can be said for Odin who we can call upon as the allfather, the mentor, the wise one, the bringer of storms, the trickster, and many many other forms.

Sutekh

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2017, 02:05:48 pm »
@King Mob It's interesting that you bring up on separating and destroying ones culture as an antinomian bases by adopting something else.

It is already happening right now, many people do not realize of how their other cultures are being destroyed through the environment itself.

I am half Russian to that extent, however I chose to break away from that culture barrier by adopting my own cultural identity as an American.

My views on self deification is rather different, originally I believed in self deification quite heavily when I adhered to LaVeys brand of Satanism.

What made me change my views on self deification was through studying many forms of black Magick, I've noticed of how some would add the concept of self deifying yourself through the practice of the Black arts.

I regard the LHP as something spiritual other than it's antinomian and the adoption of a heterodox perspective.

To me the LHP is based on the individual in which many can agree, but I think that it shouldn't revolve around self deification as much. You may disagree with me on that note.

« Last Edit: September 15, 2017, 05:42:32 pm by Sutekh »
"Our collective ambition is that the membership of the Order of the Serpent also serves as guardians of the Black Flame and collaborates with the Prince of Darkness in the Infernal Mandate of re-creating the Cosmos in the eternal glory of the Setian Will!"-Setamontet

NEMO 93

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2017, 02:51:34 pm »
@Sutekh I would mostly agreee with you, I think. I agree that you don't need to strengthen your ego to be considered Left Hand Path. There are quite a few anti-cosmic satanic beliefs. Chaos-Gnosticism which I'm currently studying, for example, works with beings who are against the material world. From what the Order of the Serpent newsletter describes, O9A seems to preach anti-cosmicism and place the individual below these anti-cosmic forces. That seems to both adhere and not adhere to both of our definitions of Left Hand Path but it is most certainly not right hand path. I am curious, by your definition would you include Thelema as Left Hand Path? Many people I know considered it middle path or right hand path. Where would middle path fit into your definition if anywhere? I'm very curious as it's hard to find a consistent definition for Left Hand Path.

On using another culture for anti-nomianism, I believe it is useful even if it might be contradictory. The people who reject the hinduism caste system to be aghora are simply adopting another culture, albeit counter culture, that use anti-nomianism as a tool. You can see that in less extreme subcultures in the US that these rebellious cultures can become a conformist prison of their own which is why I attempt to place emphasis on repeatedly doing it. I would argue that living as a Christian could be antinomian if you were raised by athiests or satanists. Anti-nomianism can either help you rebel or find a new prison which may very well be right hand path. My view is that these things are tools that can be used in either direction. I do believe antionomianism is linked somewhat to left hand path due to the inherent nature of it's focus on darker aspets that most humanity tend to reject. I think there is a sense of taboo inherent to the left hand path. This does not mean you have to push anti-nomianism as far as some of the followers as the Left Hand Path too. I would argue that this extreme dedication to an idea has it's own set of draw-backs.

I also want to emphasize that my post is not stricly about playing different beliefs but characters or roles. I used David Bowie because he dabbled in the occult and his transformations were radically different characters or roles. The use in adopting other cultures, I believe, is because it forces you to realize how many weaknesses you are holding on to from an old belief when you attempt to adopt a radically different new one. I like to compare my chaos magick philosophy to that of method acting. You start having inclinations torward a archetypal view of yourself and slowly get lost into it untto il you actually believe that is your identity. As a result, this identity is taken to the extreme to where it breaks. You know have a archetype that is strictly you that you can call on in times of need and that you know inside and out, both strengths and weaknesses, because you lived it and it came from you. For example, I could call on Dionsysius or I could call on my punk rock persona who had some very similar attitudes and because I lived as that archetype for 2 years, I know what to expect, whereas I may not with Dionysius. It makes it easier to adhere to your own will because that archetype is a distortion of your own will and as a result of being so intimate with it, you know how to play your true will of whatever your base self/ego is above it.

Xepera maSet

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Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2017, 03:30:20 pm »
Horus as a trickster deity... How did I miss that? He literally defeated Set through trickery. Very, very cool catch.

"The Dragon became as a many-headed Serpent,
It's fiery tongues bearing forth speech
Into all the kingoms of the Earth."


My book, "Behold: the Prince of Darkness!": https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1726037460/ref=dbs_a_w_dp_1726037460

Sutekh

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2017, 05:54:15 pm »
Quote
I am curious, by your definition would you include Thelema as Left Hand Path?

This has been a very complicating thing for me to include Thelema as Left Hand Path. I've tried studying Thelema before but it is a complex system for me.

On one hand if I am correct some of the concepts of Thelema is based on seeking a union with the Universe as a whole by also destroying the ego in which I have read through some of the studies of the Philosophy/religion.

From my understandment some Thelemites view Thelema differently than it's traditional setting. Aleister Crowley if I am correct regarded the Left Hand Path as the destruction of oneself by classifying those who tread on that Path is a "black brother."

So it would be hard to classify them as a middle path whether they have both concepts of two different paths.
"Our collective ambition is that the membership of the Order of the Serpent also serves as guardians of the Black Flame and collaborates with the Prince of Darkness in the Infernal Mandate of re-creating the Cosmos in the eternal glory of the Setian Will!"-Setamontet

Sutekh

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2017, 05:58:37 pm »
Quote
Where would middle path fit into your definition if anywhere? I'm very curious as it's hard to find a consistent definition for Left Hand Path. 

As far as "Middle Path" goes I often do not get to caught up with labels. However to sum it up I  would say middle path has both the views and the adherence of some of the concepts of both opposite paths.
"Our collective ambition is that the membership of the Order of the Serpent also serves as guardians of the Black Flame and collaborates with the Prince of Darkness in the Infernal Mandate of re-creating the Cosmos in the eternal glory of the Setian Will!"-Setamontet

Sutekh

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2017, 06:05:03 pm »
Quote
I also want to emphasize that my post is not stricly about playing different beliefs but characters or roles.

I understand what you were implying. What is interesting to say is that some of your concepts on playing different roles or characters and changing ones identity sounds similar to thee ONA'S view on doing insight roles.

Pardon me if some may get the wrong impression on bringing their name up since the Order is strict on talking about the group in general.

« Last Edit: September 15, 2017, 06:09:36 pm by Sutekh »
"Our collective ambition is that the membership of the Order of the Serpent also serves as guardians of the Black Flame and collaborates with the Prince of Darkness in the Infernal Mandate of re-creating the Cosmos in the eternal glory of the Setian Will!"-Setamontet

NEMO 93

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2017, 08:05:54 pm »
@Xepera maSet

Thanks. Both trickster and war deities stick to me like flies whenever I do god work which is why Horus' trickster nature jumped right out to me. I don't know what it is, it must being someting in my nature. Through personal gnosis, I have come to believe that Horus and Set are just mirrors of each other with whichever one is being repressed representing the shadow and Osiris being both the useless self being killed and the risen perfected self. I still need to do more research to verify this one day but my path has lead me in a different direction for now.

I'm really interested into reading more into the Temple of Set at a later time for this reason.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2017, 09:17:36 pm by King Mob »

Xepera maSet

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Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2017, 08:25:33 pm »
@Xepera maSet

Thanks. Both trickster and war deities stick to me like flies whenever I do god work which is why Horus' trickster nature jumped right out to me. I don't know what it is, it must being someting in my nature. Through personal gnosis, I have come to believe that Horus and Set are just mirrors of each other with whichever one the being is repressing being the shadow and Osiris being both the useless self being killed and the risen perfected self. I still need to do more research to verify this one day but my path has lead me in a different direction for now.

I'm really interested into reading more into the Temple of Set at a later time for this reason.

You may be interested in The Mysteries of Horus and Set, which can be found in The Imperishable Star v I

"The Dragon became as a many-headed Serpent,
It's fiery tongues bearing forth speech
Into all the kingoms of the Earth."


My book, "Behold: the Prince of Darkness!": https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1726037460/ref=dbs_a_w_dp_1726037460

NEMO 93

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2017, 08:55:06 pm »
@Sutekh I'm actually really glad you brought ONA up because it gives me a chance to pre-emptively clarify as some of my ideas may seem similar to them and other extreme groups despite the fact I vehemently reject the extremism of ONA and MLO both on personal principle/beliefs in addition to seeing it as counter-productive.

What it comes down to, I think, is that these groups are esentially LHP forms of Chaos Magick. Chaos Magick can draw some questionable people to begin with and there is a risk in psychological well being in paradigm shifting, the basis of all chaos magic, that some people may not be able to handle. Antinomian Paradigm Shifting would probably add more psychological stress than normal. It can be easy to see why this might snowball. I do not mean to offend anyone or their beliefs by saying this as every group has some members that give it a bad name and as a chaos magician myself, I have met quite a few people of the same belief I do not want to be associated with.

While these groups describe themselves as left of the left hand path, this is not inherent in LHP Chaos Magick. I highly recommend Thee Temple of Psychick Youth and their book entitled The Psychick Bible for a great example of LHP Chaos magick that is not extreme. The antinomianism in it is more focused on consentual sexual acts which I agree is important to explore to embrace spirituality and know thyself. This has a lot to do with my view of Satre's attempt to create existential ethics and his concept of "bad faith" which would take an entirely different journal post to explain. There's a ton of focus on individualism as well that should be incredibly useful to any LHP follower. I seriously highly recommend this book.

There seems to be plenty less extreme sects of Chaos-Gnosticism as well and that is based much on Chaos Magick's view of Kaos. Thursatru is a great example of this from what I have read thus far. It does not call for extremely criminal acts like the aforementioned groups but does work with anticosmic forces. There is even Liber Nox in Liber Null & Psychonaut that has good instructions for a LHP chaos magic. There are a few other groups such as the DKMU that would fall into this category of non-extreme LHP Chaos Magic.

As for their use of "insight roles" that seems like exactly that I do from what I read about it in the Order of Serpent's news letter. I do not know the full detail on their use of it  so i could be wrong. I have my own purely psychological techniques for it that I came to develop on my own. Personality shifting was my first magickal act which I did as a psychological expiriment 2 years before officially learning of and expirimenting with occultism. This technique brought me great success in accomplished everything I had wished for, including the stuff I should have been careful of, so naturally I have tried to develop on it after revisiting my chaos magick books when it was time for another paradigm shift. My combination of anti-nomianism that probably made it similar to the use of 'insight roles" was attempting to basing a new role on Bowie's Thin White Duke character which was his nastiest. I never had to partake in any extreme behavior to do this or because of it and it brought out a lot of stuff that I was repressing that is needed to function as long as you have control over it.

My current working theory is that if you can identify what part of your shadow you are repressing you can use these roles to re-intigrate with it. My take Thin White Duke made me come to terms with the coldness in myself that had been growing because of repression and bring it to the surface so I turned to a more pretentious role that allowed me to cut out numbing habits from my practice and focus on myself. Usually when a ego is pushed to a limit, it will break hard and you will go through trauma of some form where it will be incredibly hard to function. After doing this a few times, it becomes easier to see what you need to become next time. I've done some small expiriments incorporating occult techniques more directly into the psychological ones as well as attempting to invoke past forms through psychological and occult means but still need more data. It is definitely possible, I am just trying to find the most effective ways.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2017, 08:59:00 pm by King Mob »

NEMO 93

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2017, 09:02:15 pm »
@Xepera maSet

Thank you! I've actually been meaning too and this is a great reminder that the article is in there as I seemed to have forgot about it. I have downloaded both newsletters and read some different articles in both of them. It's definitely gave me a better idea of Setianism and it is just greatly put together in general. That article definitely seems of interest. I'll make note to check it out soon.

Setamontet

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2017, 04:37:48 pm »
"Set was also sometimes seen as the God of the foreigners." - King Mob

And this is appropriate, for in modern discernment Set/The Prince of Darkness is an essence foreign or alien to the Order of the Cosmos, and he/it will not and can never comply or assimilate to the laws which govern the Cosmic Order.

"O learn the Law, my brothers of the night - the Great Law and the Lesser Law.
The Great Law brings the balance and doth persist without mercy.
The Lesser Law abideth as the key, and the Shining Trapezoid is the door!" - Anton LaVey

Setamontet

Re: Ego disolution to strengthen the ego.
« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2017, 05:43:01 pm »
"Set was also sometimes seen as the God of the foreigners." - King Mob

And this is appropriate, for in modern discernment Set/The Prince of Darkness is an essence foreign or alien to the Order of the Cosmos, and he/it will not and can never comply or assimilate to the laws which govern the Cosmic Order.

Nor can those of His own kind, i.e. humankind, whom Set has infused the essence of his own being, return to a state of bliss or oneness with the Cosmic Order.  We our Selves, metaphysically, are become forever separate and distinct, foreign and alien.  Eternally isolated from "God", never to return to Eden.  The blessing and the curse of unique existence, such is the bond between the Lord of Darkness and mankind.

Xeper and Remanifest.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2017, 01:46:37 pm by Setamontet »

"O learn the Law, my brothers of the night - the Great Law and the Lesser Law.
The Great Law brings the balance and doth persist without mercy.
The Lesser Law abideth as the key, and the Shining Trapezoid is the door!" - Anton LaVey