Author Topic: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist  (Read 1216 times)

Liu

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #30 on: September 06, 2020, 05:56:23 pm »
Well, first the phrase is 'More Than Human' not less than human.
"Less of", not "less than" is what I was saying. "not completely human anymore".

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Think about the meaning when people say "I'm only human", it refers to our reptilian brain and our sub-human aspects.
Hm nah, I wouldn't necessarily consider that referring to that in particular. It can, but it can as easily also refer to our particularly human characteristics.

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Even though there is a Greater Self attached to all of us, very few of us aspire to find it and fewer to embrace it. For me, that is the essence of the Western Left Hand Path and nothing more or less.
Could you give an example of what aspiring to one's Greater Self would look like, to make sure we're on the same page?

Mindmaster

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #31 on: September 06, 2020, 08:11:23 pm »
He also says a couple stuff that could be taken the wrong way. And I wouldn't agree that Satanism is only for "alphas", which might also be something I took the wrong way. But overall seems like quite a decent guy. I remember watching some other, shorter interview by him a few years back getting a different impression, so either he changed or that one didn't bring his point across well.

Fundamentally, it sort of is. But, I say that with a caveat that if we look at the core of Satanic philosophy (say Nietzsche, Rand, Redbeard, etc.) it's more of the alpha that comes with the methodology of being true to one's fundamental nature and making no excuses. It's not the alpha associated with being a 'Chad' and so on. In that comment, I'm not trying to repackage it to be more acceptable just elucidating it a bit in the vein of pointing out the forest for the trees.

Re: His viewpoints, admittedly there is a bit of flux here and there in the last few years, but that happens to us all. It depends on what you will admit to yourself or whatever on that subject, but nothing prevents the change. We can choose to ignore it, but it still happens. It's not different in his case -- all ideas get expanded upon, resized, and adapted to one's own needs.

Mindmaster

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #32 on: September 06, 2020, 08:28:50 pm »
This is the fundamental flaw with the (western) left hand path people, the lack of a definitive outline as to what IS the (western) left hand path. The 'label' has become whatever you 'need' it to be and doesn't stand on its own, which is antithetical to the actual (western) LHP philosophy.


This is the very definition of the left hand path, AKA, it's what _you_ fundamentally need, but not what anyone else needs. I have no idea what the 'actual' philosophy would be a reference to, but according to my understanding we have a few ideas on LHP that we can compare and contrast.

We could pick a spiritual frame of reference and simply limit the concept to that which is 'orthodox' is 'white/right' and what is heterodox is 'black/left'. (Generally, I feel that is too simple, personally.) The distinction here is on the practices and not the individuals partaking in them. This is generally the most accepted set of definitions.

To contrast, we could take another approach and go to motive and action. The right being benevolent in nature, order-affirming, and mindful of the needs of others. In this definition, we could say the left is sinister, malicious, selfish, and the individual thinks only of themselves. Essentially, using this criteria establishes that acts not the beliefs and practices determine the 'path' one travels. Modern occultists love this one because they get to play with 'magick' and still keep most of the belief system from the first case.

But, another definition, the one I'd prefer, is based on the ideas of Peter Carroll is in reference to the end goal of either methodology being fundamentally the same. That's to say that the right is trying to achieve godliness (spiritual progress) through purity and obedience, where the left hand path is attempting to free oneself of the delusions which obscure the goal. The ultimate destination, illumination, is the goal in both cases. Not too many people hold this view -- I'm the only one I know personally.

The reason for the apparent debate here is that people haphazardly attempt to combine these ideas without any discrimination or realization of the fact that they haven't much to do with one another. This is what causes the perceived 'muddle' of the definition of the left-hand path, but there is actually no muddle just three completely different schools of thought supporting various arguments. Thus, if Lon Milo Duquette or ONA talk about the LHP they both speak in the context of the #2 case, but for very different reasons... Lon will speak of the fact that it's intent that matters and his actions are for good intents, and ONA speaks in terms of their 'sinister action' is what makes them left, etc. It's readily apparent how this can be an extremely confusing subject, lol.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2020, 08:34:52 pm by Mindmaster »

Sutekh

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #33 on: September 07, 2020, 12:21:38 am »
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What does the herd think, though? Which people are the herd? Pretty much anyone I know fulfills at least half of the criteria based on my estimation.

If you look at the masses, they all adhere to the mainstream culture (atleast I refer to it as mainstream westernized culture where I live). You come from an entirely different country as do I, where I live (refering to the United States) their is a tremendous herd mentality, be it Political action, or the Nazerene Religion. The human population the way I personally view it, all think alike to that extent. Be it through the sides of Politics, Western Religion, and through the mundane, they lack to the independent critical thinking and choose to be stuck in the docile mut. The very essence of the Left Hand Path for me is to ground yourself out of that docile mut which in my personal opinion is the key component to slowly reaching as the Übermensch.

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Pretty sure that's common also among non-occultists.

Most people I usually have to do much with in real life are 1) academics, who are 3) atheists and 4) lifelong learners - whether they are also 2) non-conformist is a bit harder to tell, but considering that they chose a profession that is based on their personal interests and where the point is progress would point to that.
And I would assume that hardly any of them has ever even heard of the LHP.

So all in all that doesn't seem too unusual to me. It's all a matter of degree, though, how high you put the bar in regards to fulfilling these criteria.

Yes, I agree with you here. As you may have seen my other commentary on achieving those goals "Non-Magically," this is the very essence of the Left Hand Path. Achieving your own Great Work by reaching to that final Level both in this existence and in the Astral Plane. These people who you refer to, are the people that you might say are in similar to the Elect, or do not realize the gift that is bestowed upon them by the Prince of Darkness.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2020, 12:43:06 am by Sutekh »
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set

Etu Malku

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #34 on: September 08, 2020, 02:28:05 am »
This is the fundamental flaw with the (western) left hand path people, the lack of a definitive outline as to what IS the (western) left hand path. The 'label' has become whatever you 'need' it to be and doesn't stand on its own, which is antithetical to the actual (western) LHP philosophy.


This is the very definition of the left hand path, AKA, it's what _you_ fundamentally need, but not what anyone else needs. I have no idea what the 'actual' philosophy would be a reference to, but according to my understanding we have a few ideas on LHP that we can compare and contrast.

We could pick a spiritual frame of reference and simply limit the concept to that which is 'orthodox' is 'white/right' and what is heterodox is 'black/left'. (Generally, I feel that is too simple, personally.) The distinction here is on the practices and not the individuals partaking in them. This is generally the most accepted set of definitions.
My only sniglet with this is, orthodoxy/heterodoxy is what the Eastern LHP is about, the same goal but different approach. To approach the LHP from heterodoxy is to confirm and accept that the religion you are opposing actually exists.

Western LHP is about antinomianism, the opposition and thus the rebellion is not against some religion, rather it is against your lesser self.

]quote]To contrast, we could take another approach and go to motive and action. The right being benevolent in nature, order-affirming, and mindful of the needs of others. In this definition, we could say the left is sinister, malicious, selfish, and the individual thinks only of themselves. Essentially, using this criteria establishes that acts not the beliefs and practices determine the 'path' one travels. Modern occultists love this one because they get to play with 'magick' and still keep most of the belief system from the first case.[/quote] Never got that the LHP had anything to do with 'sinister', or  'malice'. Also, the techniques one uses are merely tools for some intent, at least that's how I see them, one can practice magick whether they are on the LHP or not.

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But, another definition, the one I'd prefer, is based on the ideas of Peter Carroll is in reference to the end goal of either methodology being fundamentally the same. That's to say that the right is trying to achieve godliness (spiritual progress) through purity and obedience, where the left hand path is attempting to free oneself of the delusions which obscure the goal. The ultimate destination, illumination, is the goal in both cases. Not too many people hold this view -- I'm the only one I know personally.
I tend to see it like RHP teaches divinity through association with an external deity, while the WLHP teaches divinity through emulation of an inner deity (Greater Self)

Etu Malku

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #35 on: September 08, 2020, 02:33:27 am »

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Could you give an example of what aspiring to one's Greater Self would look like, to make sure we're on the same page?
If you understand Platonic First Forms, then you understand what the Greater Self is. One's Greater Self is an isolate intelligence void of the dualism present in the objective universe. As a singularity and separate from the objective universe, our Greater Self is us at our ultimate potential, a monad, the authentic psyche.

Liu

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #36 on: September 08, 2020, 08:24:57 am »
If you look at the masses, they all adhere to the mainstream culture (atleast I refer to it as mainstream westernized culture where I live). You come from an entirely different country as do I, where I live (refering to the United States) their is a tremendous herd mentality, be it Political action, or the Nazerene Religion. The human population the way I personally view it, all think alike to that extent. Be it through the sides of Politics, Western Religion, and through the mundane, they lack to the independent critical thinking and choose to be stuck in the docile mut. The very essence of the Left Hand Path for me is to ground yourself out of that docile mut which in my personal opinion is the key component to slowly reaching as the Übermensch.
We also have mainstream culture here, but whether you like those forms of culture or not seems mainly to have to do with personal preferences.
I indirectly know some people who might belong to the herd, yet once I get to know someone better that tends to disperse such prejudices of mine towards them, so it's likely that the herd only exists as a prejudice.

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Yes, I agree with you here. As you may have seen my other commentary on achieving those goals "Non-Magically," this is the very essence of the Left Hand Path. Achieving your own Great Work by reaching to that final Level both in this existence and in the Astral Plane. These people who you refer to, are the people that you might say are in similar to the Elect, or do not realize the gift that is bestowed upon them by the Prince of Darkness.

But that seems like what humans are like in general. If they don't strive for their goals, it's because something's seriously wrong. Or do I just hang out with the "wrong" people? My range of social contacts is fairly limited. Sure I also know a couple people who don't (visibly) strive much but they either are really old or they have some mental health issue. And even then you could say that they are working on their goals, just not making much headway, or that they simply see no way in how to proceed.
Again, it's rather about how high you set the bar.

Fundamentally, it sort of is. But, I say that with a caveat that if we look at the core of Satanic philosophy (say Nietzsche, Rand, Redbeard, etc.)
My knowledge of Nietzsche, Rand and Redbeard is pretty basic, and at least with Rand's writings it didn't seem very agreeable to me. So I'm not sure whether I would describe that as much of the core of my philosophy, and I heard from some satanists more knowledgeable in these writings that they don't subscribe to them whatsoever.

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it's more of the alpha that comes with the methodology of being true to one's fundamental nature and making no excuses. It's not the alpha associated with being a 'Chad' and so on.
My fundamental nature includes making compromises and not making no excuses, lol.

This is the very definition of the left hand path, AKA, it's what _you_ fundamentally need, but not what anyone else needs. I have no idea what the 'actual' philosophy would be a reference to, but according to my understanding we have a few ideas on LHP that we can compare and contrast.
[...]
[the] definition [...] I'd prefer, is based on the ideas of Peter Carroll is in reference to the end goal of either methodology being fundamentally the same. That's to say that the right is trying to achieve godliness (spiritual progress) through purity and obedience, where the left hand path is attempting to free oneself of the delusions which obscure the goal. The ultimate destination, illumination, is the goal in both cases. Not too many people hold this view -- I'm the only one I know personally.
That sounds quite agreeable to me. I'm not sure why you think you're the only one holding that view, I wrote pretty much the same thing as your first 3 lines here in this very thread a couple posts ago.

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We could pick a spiritual frame of reference and simply limit the concept to that which is 'orthodox' is 'white/right' and what is heterodox is 'black/left'. (Generally, I feel that is too simple, personally.) The distinction here is on the practices and not the individuals partaking in them. This is generally the most accepted set of definitions.

To contrast, we could take another approach and go to motive and action. The right being benevolent in nature, order-affirming, and mindful of the needs of others. In this definition, we could say the left is sinister, malicious, selfish, and the individual thinks only of themselves. Essentially, using this criteria establishes that acts not the beliefs and practices determine the 'path' one travels. Modern occultists love this one because they get to play with 'magick' and still keep most of the belief system from the first case.
A combination of these two approaches seems most common to me among people who identify as RHPers.

Quote
The reason for the apparent debate here is that people haphazardly attempt to combine these ideas without any discrimination or realization of the fact that they haven't much to do with one another. This is what causes the perceived 'muddle' of the definition of the left-hand path, but there is actually no muddle just three completely different schools of thought supporting various arguments. Thus, if Lon Milo Duquette or ONA talk about the LHP they both speak in the context of the #2 case, but for very different reasons... Lon will speak of the fact that it's intent that matters and his actions are for good intents, and ONA speaks in terms of their 'sinister action' is what makes them left, etc. It's readily apparent how this can be an extremely confusing subject, lol.
Good example - and I could argue that Lon Milo Duquette is more LHP than the ONA.

Could you give an example of what aspiring to one's Greater Self would look like, to make sure we're on the same page?
If you understand Platonic First Forms, then you understand what the Greater Self is. One's Greater Self is an isolate intelligence void of the dualism present in the objective universe. As a singularity and separate from the objective universe, our Greater Self is us at our ultimate potential, a monad, the authentic psyche.
Thanks, but dude, I asked for a tangible real life example and you get started with platonic ideas? xD How does moving towards your Greater Self look like in your practice or in the practice of someone you know, or in a hypothetical case?
« Last Edit: September 08, 2020, 09:09:45 am by Liu »

Etu Malku

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #37 on: September 08, 2020, 02:06:38 pm »
If you look at the masses, they all adhere to the mainstream culture (atleast I refer to it as mainstream westernized culture where I live). You come from an entirely different country as do I, where I live (refering to the United States) their is a tremendous herd mentality, be it Political action, or the Nazerene Religion. The human population the way I personally view it, all think alike to that extent. Be it through the sides of Politics, Western Religion, and through the mundane, they lack to the independent critical thinking and choose to be stuck in the docile mut. The very essence of the Left Hand Path for me is to ground yourself out of that docile mut which in my personal opinion is the key component to slowly reaching as the Übermensch.
We also have mainstream culture here, but whether you like those forms of culture or not seems mainly to have to do with personal preferences.
I indirectly know some people who might belong to the herd, yet once I get to know someone better that tends to disperse such prejudices of mine towards them, so it's likely that the herd only exists as a prejudice.

Quote
Yes, I agree with you here. As you may have seen my other commentary on achieving those goals "Non-Magically," this is the very essence of the Left Hand Path. Achieving your own Great Work by reaching to that final Level both in this existence and in the Astral Plane. These people who you refer to, are the people that you might say are in similar to the Elect, or do not realize the gift that is bestowed upon them by the Prince of Darkness.

But that seems like what humans are like in general. If they don't strive for their goals, it's because something's seriously wrong. Or do I just hang out with the "wrong" people? My range of social contacts is fairly limited. Sure I also know a couple people who don't (visibly) strive much but they either are really old or they have some mental health issue. And even then you could say that they are working on their goals, just not making much headway, or that they simply see no way in how to proceed.
Again, it's rather about how high you set the bar.

Fundamentally, it sort of is. But, I say that with a caveat that if we look at the core of Satanic philosophy (say Nietzsche, Rand, Redbeard, etc.)
My knowledge of Nietzsche, Rand and Redbeard is pretty basic, and at least with Rand's writings it didn't seem very agreeable to me. So I'm not sure whether I would describe that as much of the core of my philosophy, and I heard from some satanists more knowledgeable in these writings that they don't subscribe to them whatsoever.

Quote
it's more of the alpha that comes with the methodology of being true to one's fundamental nature and making no excuses. It's not the alpha associated with being a 'Chad' and so on.
My fundamental nature includes making compromises and not making no excuses, lol.

This is the very definition of the left hand path, AKA, it's what _you_ fundamentally need, but not what anyone else needs. I have no idea what the 'actual' philosophy would be a reference to, but according to my understanding we have a few ideas on LHP that we can compare and contrast.
[...]
[the] definition [...] I'd prefer, is based on the ideas of Peter Carroll is in reference to the end goal of either methodology being fundamentally the same. That's to say that the right is trying to achieve godliness (spiritual progress) through purity and obedience, where the left hand path is attempting to free oneself of the delusions which obscure the goal. The ultimate destination, illumination, is the goal in both cases. Not too many people hold this view -- I'm the only one I know personally.
That sounds quite agreeable to me. I'm not sure why you think you're the only one holding that view, I wrote pretty much the same thing as your first 3 lines here in this very thread a couple posts ago.

Quote
We could pick a spiritual frame of reference and simply limit the concept to that which is 'orthodox' is 'white/right' and what is heterodox is 'black/left'. (Generally, I feel that is too simple, personally.) The distinction here is on the practices and not the individuals partaking in them. This is generally the most accepted set of definitions.

To contrast, we could take another approach and go to motive and action. The right being benevolent in nature, order-affirming, and mindful of the needs of others. In this definition, we could say the left is sinister, malicious, selfish, and the individual thinks only of themselves. Essentially, using this criteria establishes that acts not the beliefs and practices determine the 'path' one travels. Modern occultists love this one because they get to play with 'magick' and still keep most of the belief system from the first case.
A combination of these two approaches seems most common to me among people who identify as RHPers.

Quote
The reason for the apparent debate here is that people haphazardly attempt to combine these ideas without any discrimination or realization of the fact that they haven't much to do with one another. This is what causes the perceived 'muddle' of the definition of the left-hand path, but there is actually no muddle just three completely different schools of thought supporting various arguments. Thus, if Lon Milo Duquette or ONA talk about the LHP they both speak in the context of the #2 case, but for very different reasons... Lon will speak of the fact that it's intent that matters and his actions are for good intents, and ONA speaks in terms of their 'sinister action' is what makes them left, etc. It's readily apparent how this can be an extremely confusing subject, lol.
Good example - and I could argue that Lon Milo Duquette is more LHP than the ONA.

Could you give an example of what aspiring to one's Greater Self would look like, to make sure we're on the same page?
If you understand Platonic First Forms, then you understand what the Greater Self is. One's Greater Self is an isolate intelligence void of the dualism present in the objective universe. As a singularity and separate from the objective universe, our Greater Self is us at our ultimate potential, a monad, the authentic psyche.
Thanks, but dude, I asked for a tangible real life example and you get started with platonic ideas? xD How does moving towards your Greater Self look like in your practice or in the practice of someone you know, or in a hypothetical case?
Ok . . . it looks like this ;)

Sutekh

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #38 on: September 08, 2020, 09:00:10 pm »
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But that seems like what humans are like in general. If they don't strive for their goals, it's because something's seriously wrong.

At the same time I find these to be all excuses, my personal take rather varies. Sure we can argue that a human who is a drugged fiend does have a certain problem, but that can be entirely overcome if they choose to will it. Correct me if I am wrong, but I have the feeling you are more of an idealist from reading many of your responses respectfully, I look at things rather non Idealistically.
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set

Sutekh

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #39 on: September 08, 2020, 09:05:09 pm »
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We also have mainstream culture here, but whether you like those forms of culture or not seems mainly to have to do with personal preferences.

Wasn't necessarily implying the U.S. as the only Westernized Mainstream Culture. Yes we can both say that Mainstream culture can be split into different fragments, which my other commentary was trying to imply. However, yes we can say that the average person has a personal preference for culture's. But what separates me from the rest is going to the extremes by completely isolating myself from these preferences of culture's in order to achieve what I want to achieve on my bridge.
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set

Sutekh

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #40 on: September 08, 2020, 09:08:44 pm »
Quote
Sure I also know a couple people who don't (visibly) strive much but they either are really old or they have some mental health issue. And even then you could say that they are working on their goals, just not making much headway, or that they simply see no way in how to proceed.
Again, it's rather about how high you set the bar.

Again, I am not arguing with you on how "high you set the bar," however I believe in taking that highness much more deeper.
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set

Sutekh

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #41 on: September 08, 2020, 09:17:59 pm »
Quote
To approach the LHP from heterodoxy is to confirm and accept that the religion you are opposing actually exists.

Western LHP is about antinomianism, the opposition and thus the rebellion is not against some religion, rather it is against your lesser self.

I can agree with that point of view of the Western Left Hand Path, including your statement concerning the approach to the LHP. However if one began's on the Western Left Hand Path, wouldn't their rebellion first start on some "religion" then move going against that Lesser Self? The way I see it, is an evolution when one is on the Western Left Hand Path.
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set

Liu

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #42 on: September 09, 2020, 04:45:34 am »
Ok . . . it looks like this ;)
I get it. So you don't want to get into specifics. Of course the whole of oneself is the result, but that's not gonna help me understand what exactly you count as progressing on the path and which things you wouldn't count.


At the same time I find these to be all excuses, my personal take rather varies. Sure we can argue that a human who is a drugged fiend does have a certain problem, but that can be entirely overcome if they choose to will it. Correct me if I am wrong, but I have the feeling you are more of an idealist from reading many of your responses respectfully, I look at things rather non Idealistically.
Huh, why? Do you think I reacted to Etu's 2nd to last comment as I did if I were that much of an adherent of idealism?

And I'm not convinced that people can just will themselves to overcome their problems. It helps but it's far from enough. Unless you count only people as satanists who are capable of that - if so, then I'm none.

Wasn't necessarily implying the U.S. as the only Westernized Mainstream Culture. Yes we can both say that Mainstream culture can be split into different fragments, which my other commentary was trying to imply. However, yes we can say that the average person has a personal preference for culture's. But what separates me from the rest is going to the extremes by completely isolating myself from these preferences of culture's in order to achieve what I want to achieve on my bridge.

That separation is kinda what I started with long before I ever heard of the LHP. Much of what I learned in the meantime could be summarized as "the mainstream isn't that bad" or "people in general aren't that bad". And knowing a bit of mainstream culture is quite useful in keeping relationships.

Again, I am not arguing with you on how "high you set the bar," however I believe in taking that highness much more deeper.

I.e. higher you mean by deeper?

The only problem in setting the bar too low I see is that it includes results that are very far off from an ideal result of the path. But the direction and intent are still there.

It's just not within the means of everyone all the time due to their circumstances to get to the level of, for example, personal freedom that the path calls for. But that doesn't mean they can't try and move into that direction and thereby still benefit from the path.


Quote from: Etu Malku
To approach the LHP from heterodoxy is to confirm and accept that the religion you are opposing actually exists.

Western LHP is about antinomianism, the opposition and thus the rebellion is not against some religion, rather it is against your lesser self.

I can agree with that point of view of the Western Left Hand Path, including your statement concerning the approach to the LHP. However if one began's on the Western Left Hand Path, wouldn't their rebellion first start on some "religion" then move going against that Lesser Self? The way I see it, is an evolution when one is on the Western Left Hand Path.

Probably, but that religion (or any ideology they grew up in) is thereby part of their lesser self if I understand that terminology correctly.

Etu Malku

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #43 on: September 09, 2020, 09:39:29 pm »
Ok . . . it looks like this ;)
I get it. So you don't want to get into specifics. Of course the whole of oneself is the result, but that's not gonna help me understand what exactly you count as progressing on the path and which things you wouldn't count.
I can give you a chaotic example of when we might come into the awareness of our Greater Self. If you've ever been in a car accident there are those moments where you are entirely outside of yourself observing the actual accident, and for some even immediately afterward for a few fleeting moments. If you managed to maneuver out of say, a multiple car collision, as I have, you can't but look back and wonder what the hell was guiding you through that. Perhaps it was luck, but more likely it was the YOU that is not present in your normal, everyday, mundane existence. In a situation such as this, one can easily sense an external agency acting in your best interest.

As for 'progressing' on the Path, it is the conscious effort to strengthen this connection with one's Greater Self in order to enable those qualities to remain present in the now of your existence.

Liu

Re: 2 Hour interview with a well known public Satanist
« Reply #44 on: September 10, 2020, 07:04:21 am »
I can give you a chaotic example of when we might come into the awareness of our Greater Self. If you've ever been in a car accident there are those moments where you are entirely outside of yourself observing the actual accident, and for some even immediately afterward for a few fleeting moments. If you managed to maneuver out of say, a multiple car collision, as I have, you can't but look back and wonder what the hell was guiding you through that. Perhaps it was luck, but more likely it was the YOU that is not present in your normal, everyday, mundane existence. In a situation such as this, one can easily sense an external agency acting in your best interest.

As for 'progressing' on the Path, it is the conscious effort to strengthen this connection with one's Greater Self in order to enable those qualities to remain present in the now of your existence.
Thanks! I'm a bit surprised. I recall several of your writings in which you warn against taking things as genuine spiritual experiences that can be explained to be caused by brain chemistry. And it's to be expected that getting into a life-threatening situation would put one into a specific mindset.

Now I haven't ever been in any big accident or similar. But I had several situations in which I might have gotten seriously hurt, but was lucky enough I didn't. Usually, my thoughts are then rather on relief and on how to avoid getting into the respective situation again than on ascribing the outcome to any higher power, and I'm also not sure whether I've ever experienced that kind of feeling of being outside myself which you describe. And if it was really bad I might also cuddle up and cry for a bit if in privacy to get over the shock.

I also thank my deity for getting away unharmed, though (which is in so far similar to your concept of the greater self as also there, one is a part or manifestation of it).
And also when praying I thereby ascribe to it that it had helped me and may help me in risky situations in the future.
But that doesn't really convince me of its existence as a self-aware being, I primarily see that as a psychological technique to help me with anxiety and strengthen my confidence.