Author Topic: The Abyss  (Read 1362 times)

Hammerheart

The Abyss
« on: July 11, 2017, 09:30:07 pm »
I wanted to make a thread regarding the Thelemic concept of the Abyss. I thought this was LHP enough to post here, but if not, I apologize. I wanted to talk about this from my understandings, and then have that improved upon as I do not think that my knowledge of this is very sound. Crowley himself stated that this was extremely difficult to explain.

So, from what I know, the Abyss is a way of describing the void between Noumena and Phenomena. In the simplest sense, a Noumenon is an underlying causative presence for a Phenomenon. For example, the noumenon behind the emission of light from a lightbulb is the electricity flowing through the filament, which can not be seen aside from its phenomenal effects.

My confusion begins at where the Abyss comes in. Crowley says that crossing the Abyss is a dangerous, but necessary method of achieving an ultimate wisdom. The obvious meaning seems too elementary. A very stupid person might look at a lightbulb from a purely phenomenal standpoint, with no understanding or interest in what is causing the glow, but everyone with sapient abilities understands that any visible occurrence has an underlying cause. This could be complicated if we're talking about the presence of basic matter having some underlying Noumena (physical existence itself), but what does this have to do with wisdom. Possibly, a Noumenal understanding of the world gives one a more objective, impartial view of the world. Maybe he is talking about the meaning of existence?

Share your thoughts.

Xepera-maSet

  • Guest
Re: The Abyss
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2017, 09:56:44 pm »
I don't think there is an abyss, it was a way to write Daath out of the tree, or for the "Tree after the Fall." On the other side of Daath is supposedly the "all" for the RHP to follow, but the LHP, what Crowley called the black brotherhood, is within or through Daath.

Setamontet

Re: The Abyss
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2017, 10:13:50 pm »
From a Setian Hermeticist perspective the "Abyss" is the limitless depths of knowledge and truth of this Universe.  The infinite darkness between the known and the unknown.  The "crossing of the Abyss" is the Initiatory/Self-Evolutionary process of exploring certain depths of the Universe and developing your own introspective/subjective Understanding of it.  Which can take years upon decades of study and practice.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 10:17:21 pm by Setamontet »
"Ia Shub-Niggurath!  May the gifted of Set rule on a thousand worlds when that night falls on Terra!  When the stars come right again!" - Patricia Hardy

Sutekh

Re: The Abyss
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2017, 04:25:56 pm »
Quote
  From a Setian Hermeticist perspective the "Abyss" is the limitless depths of knowledge and truth of this Universe.  The infinite darkness between the known and the unknown.


I am in complete agreement with Setamontet on this, the abyss to me is a realm of the Darkness and the Unknown a lot like the Subjective Universe. In many of my beginnings of doing typical workings I might add in my invocation or evocation on summoning the Dark Lord from the Southern abyss, the eastern abyss, the northern abyss, and the western abyss subconsciously without knowing.
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set

Sutekh

Re: The Abyss
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2017, 04:33:19 pm »
Quote
The "crossing of the Abyss" is the Initiatory/Self-Evolutionary process of exploring certain depths of the Universe and developing your own introspective/subjective Understanding of it.  Which can take years upon decades of study and practice.

I agree, when I was a beginning Novice studying Magick, I was at that time experimenting with Sethian/typhonian Magick back then. I was practicing independently with degree systems as well such as degree 1st in which one is a neophyte, it took me a while to cross my own abyss by graduating from my gift of the Black Flame. Initiation to me does not happen so quickly just because you might feel that you finally past your test of Magick. Initiation happens when one feels that they are ready to finally cross those lines of limits in which one can interpret that saying as crossing the abyss.  When I was originally filling out the O.S. application during the beginning year of the Organizations development I shared a Rite of Mine which was a Rite of Crossing my own abyss more or less.
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set

Sutekh

Re: The Abyss
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2017, 04:36:00 pm »
                                                                                     My Initiation to the 4th and 5th degree.-    I light the black candles representing the forces of Darkness, the powers of darkness, the black flame, and the Lords of darkness. O Satan I call your name from the South of the gates of Hell.  For I am ready to be tested by the Dark Gods. For I am ready to cross the abyss.  For months I have felt the Adversarial forces within me and upon this world.  I have broken everything by my mentoring from the Dark Gods.  O Satan you are the one and true Prince of Darkness that hath taught me the Adversarial and dark praxis.  For you hath taught me indulgence and diabolism.  I hail the one and only Dark Lord.  Hail Satan.  O Set God of chaos, and Xeper, I call you from the ancient burial mounds.  I am worthy to cross the final path.  For I am ready.  Set, you have taught me everything which I hath grasped, For I understand that you are not a teacher but a tester.  I have felt the tests of myself within this path.  For I am constantly battling you and Har-Wer, I ask this to end, for I realize the true principles of Xeper and remanifest.  Grant me O Set to cross the abyss.  O Asmodeus Demon of Lust, you hath taught me well.  For I hath accomplished the things I have gained by the carnal aspects of the Left Hand Path.  Hail Asmodeus. O Samael and Lilith, you are important to me and my very aspects of my being.  I feel your aspects unified within me.  For you are the seducer of men.  O Lucifer from the east the one who brings knowledge, wisdom, and intelligence, for you hath given the gift of your very aspects unto me, for I am thankful that you hath given me the knowledge, wisdom, and intellectualism among this path that I have accomplished.  I feel the burdens of anger, and violence, and depression.  For I realize that I am battling Har-Wer and Set.  I realize that man has xepered always.  I realize that life is dead, and that Life does not have any objective meaning to me.  I realize that my friends have xepered and are dead to me.  I shine forth my sigil of Baphomet representing my true aspects as a Satanist.  I cross the abyss outside of my path.  I thank Set, Lucifer, Satan, Lilith, and Samael and all the other dark gods for mentoring me among this path.  I see the Pentagram of Set representing Darkness and the Subjective Universe.  I have been chosen as a DOMINUS LIMINUS,  I have reached my self deification as a God himself.  I have passed through the Black Flame and my dark path.  For I entitle myself an ADEPTUS INFERIOR.  I thank the Dark Gods for teaching and integrating the things that I have integrated and accomplished outside of society.  Hail Satan, Hail Set, Hail Lucifer, Hail Samael and Lilith and all the other Lords and demons of darkness.[/center][/color]
"To achieve Xem, the Setian must perceive what he can of Xem, and must Become that
perception. He must incorporate the knowledge, understanding, and lessons of that perception
into the Setian's being. Remanifesting that ennobled state, the Setian will perceive more of
Xem, and will be able to Xeper further towards Xem. It is only through pursuit of this
repeating cycle of perceive / achieve that the initiate will eventually near and reach Xem"- Ruby Tablet of Set