Author Topic: Alien Elite  (Read 1085 times)

Hapu

Alien Elite
« on: September 23, 2019, 02:02:18 pm »
Elite is what I am in certain areas, what I strive to make myself in other areas, and what I will never be in the remaining areas.

Alien is what I find myself to be in my surrounding society because I question all things.

Self-identifying as a Satanist does not make me an alien elite. Quite the contrary. The arrow of causality flies in the exact opposite direction. Knowing myself to be alien and fractionally elite, and having a flair for the dramatic and a taste for Gothic imagery, I know I'd be fooling myself if I didn't self-identify as a Satanist.

Popular motto: "Satanists are born not made." The above explains what that means.

 

Hapu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2019, 11:19:53 pm »
Alien is one thing and elite is another. Many Satanists confuse the two.

For example, here is a passage from Nietzsche's "Will to Power":

-----------
286.
Let us not deceive ourselves! When a man hears the whisper of the moral imperative in his breast, as altruism would have him hear it, he shows thereby that he belongs to the herd. When a man is conscious of the opposite feelings - that is to say, when he sees his danger and his undoing in disinterested and unselfish actions - then he does not belong to the herd.
-----------

Elite, then? No. Alien.


The next passage from Nietzsche's "Will to Power":

------------
287.
My philosophy aims at a new order of rank, not at an individualistic morality. The spirit of the herd should rule within the herd - but not beyond it: the leaders of the herd require a fundamentally different valuation for their actions, as do also the independent ones or the beasts of prey, etc.
-------------

Here we have at least four categories:
1. Herd
2. Leaders of the Herd
3. Independent Ones
4. Beasts of Prey

Think about number 3. In the wild, independent ones could be, for example, squirrels. Are squirrels better than sheep? If so - Why? No, they're just different from sheep.

Can a squirrel be mediocre? Yes. Can an antelope who leads the herd be mediocre? Yes. Can a leopard be mediocre? Yes.

To be elite is to not be mediocre. If I am a squirrel and I want to be elite, then I must surpass the average squirrel in some area, perhaps the speed with which I climb a tree. If I am the leading antelope in the herd, and I want to be elite, then I must surpass the average leading antelope in some area, perhaps the alertness with which I identify approaching danger. If I am a leopard and I want to be elite, then I must surpass the average leopard in some area, perhaps the accuracy with which I pounce.

Simply being a squirrel, a leading antelope, or a leopard is not enough.

Questioning everything makes me alien. It doesn't make me elite. If I want to be elite, then I have to be better at something than the average person. If I run a foot race with a Born Again Christian, and my opponent beats me by a hundred yards, it would be ridiculous for me to stand there and tell the person who just beat the pants off me all about how elite I am.

IALPRT

  • Guest
Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2019, 11:49:04 pm »
An interesting and well-thought out piece.

I'm of the opinion that the alien elite he's referring to is (and I really don't want to keep playing this card, but it applies) descriptive, not prescriptive.

You either are or you aren't, and no amount of work or study will change that.

These are types of humans who are just inexplicably omnicapable. They learn quick. Undifferentiated mastery of things happens at an accelerated rate. Intelligent, physically fit, easy on the eyes, imaginative, focused, competent in any area they are tasked with focusing on, and talented in several - on the whole: "better than you." Antinomian - in the sense that, by virtue of a something akin to grace or natural ability, the law simply does not apply.

And although they sometimes do or do not act like it, they know it... and they also know their kind.

Either it describes you or it doesn't. If it simply describes the person you'd like to be___ well I've got some disappointing news for you.

The Nietzsches have always far-outnumbered the Ubermenschen.

« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 12:00:24 am by IALPRT »

Hapu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2019, 09:59:37 am »
An interesting and well-thought out piece.

I'm of the opinion that the alien elite he's referring to is (and I really don't want to keep playing this card, but it applies) descriptive, not prescriptive.

You either are or you aren't, and no amount of work or study will change that.

True if we're talking about the potentially elite. To call an infant elite would be ridiculous. Unless of course the infant is better than others at controlling the household via caterwauling. But potentially elite? This an infant can be, and another infant may not be.

Bear in mind, I am on a journey of dialogue with Nietzsche. I want to know what he's saying, but I also want to formulate my own assessment of what, in my opinion, he should be saying.

In my system of thought, the possible and the manifest are two distinct realms, unbreakably tied together, perfectly equal over infinite time, but distinct nonetheless. I may be potentially an elite weightlifter, but until I put the work in, I will not have made manifest my eliteness.

I also reject as abomination the vision of some broken down failure who claims to be elite as he drinks himself to oblivion while his life collapses around him. Potentially elite? Maybe. Eliteness made manifest? No. Hell no.

These are types of humans who are just inexplicably omnicapable. They learn quick. Undifferentiated mastery of things happens at an accelerated rate. Intelligent, physically fit, easy on the eyes, imaginative, focused, competent in any area they are tasked with focusing on, and talented in several - on the whole: "better than you." Antinomian - in the sense that, by virtue of a something akin to grace or natural ability, the law simply does not apply.

Even these must make manifest what they potentially are. I demand evidence.

Don't get me wrong. Many of these "inexplicably omnicapable" ones will amply demonstrate their manifest superiority. I look forward to seeing that. Evidence of superiority always pleases me. It's like a rainbow or a sunrise for my spirit.

What we must avoid is opening the door (and it has already been opened, so it must be closed) for anyone who puts on a Baphomet to lay claim to being elite. No, no, never. The sorriest bum on skid row can put on a Baphomet, give the sign of the horns, and bellow, "Hail Satan!" He may even be able to pay the going rate for a CoS ID card. Still not elite. "Show me what you can do," that must be our watchword.
 
And although they sometimes do or do not act like it, they know it... and they also know their kind.

Or they say they do. Talk is cheap. Megalomania is illness unless I can back it up with evidence.

Either it describes you or it doesn't. If it simply describes the person you'd like to be___ well I've got some disappointing news for you.

The Nietzsches have always far-outnumbered the Ubermenschen.

If I'm sure I'm the Ubermensch but I have no evidence, what I'm demonstrating is self-deceit. "Knowing" without "proving" is delusion.



Hapu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2019, 10:27:22 am »

------------
287.
My philosophy aims at a new order of rank, not at an individualistic morality. The spirit of the herd should rule within the herd - but not beyond it: the leaders of the herd require a fundamentally different valuation for their actions, as do also the independent ones or the beasts of prey, etc.
-------------

Here we have at least four categories:
1. Herd
2. Leaders of the Herd
3. Independent Ones
4. Beasts of Prey


Four categories, alien to one another. What fundamental valuations for their actions would be appropriate?

Here I'll be speaking strictly of humans.

I'll discuss four principles and how I assess their valuation:
1. Concern for all humans in general.
2. Concern for enemies.
3. Concern for individual comrades.
4. Concern for self.

Herd Human
1. Concern for all humans in general: HIGH
2. Concern for enemies: MODERATE except when bullets are flying, then NEGATIVE HIGH
3. Concern for individual comrades: HIGH
4. Concern for self: LOW

Human Herd Leader
1. Concern for all humans in general: MODERATE to LOW
2. Concern for enemies: NEGATIVE HIGH
3. Concern for individual comrades: HIGH except when bullets are flying, then MODERATE to LOW
4. Concern for self: MODERATE

Human Loner
1. Concern for all humans in general: LOW
2. Concern for enemies: NEGATIVE HIGH
3. Concern for individual comrades: N/A if a true loner
4. Concern for self: HIGH

Human Predator
1. Concern for all humans in general: NEGATIVE HIGH but may preserve the species to preserve supply
2. Concern for enemies: NEGATIVE HIGH
3. Concern for individual comrades: N/A or LOW
4. Concern for self: HIGH


Differing valuations for different orders of rank in humanity was a big part of Nietzsche's message.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 10:30:13 am by Hapu »

IALPRT

  • Guest
Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2019, 10:38:18 am »
It's a dog-whistle this "Alien elite". You either are it and you hear it, or you aren't and you struggle with its meaning as you seem to be. On the outside looking in.

Many people do struggle with it; drowning in a teaspoon of water with its concepts, granted, but there is nothing in the Satanic Bible that warrants this amount of over-thinking. It's really just not that kind of a book. Mystics, philosophers, theoreticians and pencil pushers were never its intended audience. It's meant for a completely different kind.

Quote
What we must avoid is opening the door (and it has already been opened, so it must be closed) for anyone who puts on a Baphomet to lay claim to being elite. No, no, never. The sorriest bum on skid row can put on a Baphomet, give the sign of the horns, and bellow, "Hail Satan!" He may even be able to pay the going rate for a CoS ID card. Still not elite. "Show me what you can do," that must be our watchword.

Do you have a mouse in your pocket? Who's "we"? You don't speak for me.

In fact, aside from your musturbatory lonesome, you don't speak for anyone. I could not possibly care less about the nature of what filigree or hand gestures anyone chooses to display. I do not concern myself with the styles or abilities - and certainly not the socioeconomic position - of others to such a patently unhinged degree.

Quote
If I'm sure I'm the Ubermensch but I have no evidence, what I'm demonstrating is self-deceit. "Knowing" without "proving" is delusion.
Only philosophers concern themselves with evidence or living up to an ideal of the Ubermensch. If you have to ask, you'll never know or in this case, be.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 11:01:57 am by IALPRT »

Hapu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #6 on: September 24, 2019, 04:05:19 pm »
It's a dog-whistle this "Alien elite". You either are it and you hear it, or you aren't and you struggle with its meaning as you seem to be. On the outside looking in.

Many people do struggle with it; drowning in a teaspoon of water with its concepts, granted, but there is nothing in the Satanic Bible that warrants this amount of over-thinking.

TSB is a starting point, not a destination. The concept of the alien elite was developed independently of TSB, though of course informed by it.

It's really just not that kind of a book. Mystics, philosophers, theoreticians and pencil pushers were never its intended audience. It's meant for a completely different kind.

And what kind would that be?

Quote
What we must avoid is opening the door (and it has already been opened, so it must be closed) for anyone who puts on a Baphomet to lay claim to being elite. No, no, never. The sorriest bum on skid row can put on a Baphomet, give the sign of the horns, and bellow, "Hail Satan!" He may even be able to pay the going rate for a CoS ID card. Still not elite. "Show me what you can do," that must be our watchword.

Do you have a mouse in your pocket? Who's "we"? You don't speak for me.

So you endorse the skid row bum who claims to be elite because he wears a Baphomet, gives the sign of the horns, and bellows, "Hail Satan!"

In fact, aside from your musturbatory lonesome, you don't speak for anyone.

I speak for myself and those of like mind. Nevertheless, I didn't need the plural pronoun. Singular would have been less of an invitation to the argumentative type.

So what are your requirements for being elite? You seem to imply that one simply "knows" one is elite. Sort of a faith versus works argument. "I believe I'm elite, therefore I am." Here I have an odd bedfellow in the person of Saint James, who said, "Faith without works is dead." Except I would be more graphic and say faith (in oneself as elite) without works is less even than an aborted fetus. Less even than a miscarried embryo. The sperm never reached the egg. Deeds are what count, not beliefs.

Quote
If I'm sure I'm the Ubermensch but I have no evidence, what I'm demonstrating is self-deceit. "Knowing" without "proving" is delusion.
Only philosophers concern themselves with evidence

You seriously typed that. Wow.

or living up to an ideal of the Ubermensch.

Perish forbid. Some work might be required.

« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 06:35:39 pm by Hapu »

Liu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #7 on: September 24, 2019, 05:36:01 pm »
Questioning everything makes me alien. It doesn't make me elite. If I want to be elite, then I have to be better at something than the average person.
It may make you elite in your mental capabilities, or at least a bit better than the average.

If I'm sure I'm the Ubermensch but I have no evidence, what I'm demonstrating is self-deceit. "Knowing" without "proving" is delusion.
True. Just, one of the unwritten goals of magick is not caring whether you are better or worse than others but being only concerned whether you fit your own standards and surpass your own past shortcomings.
It doesn't matter then whether you are objectively superior, because for yourself that doesn't play any role.

Hapu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #8 on: September 24, 2019, 06:42:08 pm »
Questioning everything makes me alien. It doesn't make me elite. If I want to be elite, then I have to be better at something than the average person.
It may make you elite in your mental capabilities, or at least a bit better than the average.

My cat questions everything. Then again, if my cat could talk, she'd probably tell you she's elite. She's certainly alien - the very epitome of the aloof observer and the solitary practitioner.


If I'm sure I'm the Ubermensch but I have no evidence, what I'm demonstrating is self-deceit. "Knowing" without "proving" is delusion.
True. Just, one of the unwritten goals of magick is not caring whether you are better or worse than others but being only concerned whether you fit your own standards and surpass your own past shortcomings.
It doesn't matter then whether you are objectively superior, because for yourself that doesn't play any role.

Probably, then, the practitioner wouldn't use a word like "elite," since such a word would bear no relevance to the practice.

Liu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2019, 07:20:28 pm »
Questioning everything makes me alien. It doesn't make me elite. If I want to be elite, then I have to be better at something than the average person.
It may make you elite in your mental capabilities, or at least a bit better than the average.

My cat questions everything. Then again, if my cat could talk, she'd probably tell you she's elite. She's certainly alien - the very epitome of the aloof observer and the solitary practitioner.
We do have some thread somewhere on cats being Satanists, so...

Quote
If I'm sure I'm the Ubermensch but I have no evidence, what I'm demonstrating is self-deceit. "Knowing" without "proving" is delusion.
True. Just, one of the unwritten goals of magick is not caring whether you are better or worse than others but being only concerned whether you fit your own standards and surpass your own past shortcomings.
It doesn't matter then whether you are objectively superior, because for yourself that doesn't play any role.

Probably, then, the practitioner wouldn't use a word like "elite," since such a word would bear no relevance to the practice.
That is quite likely. They might use it for psychological reasons nevertheless.
I don't really use that term "elite", but considering oneself something better for not caring about whether one is something better than others is quite possible and even encouraging xD

Km Anu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #10 on: September 24, 2019, 07:45:21 pm »
Questioning everything makes me alien. It doesn't make me elite. If I want to be elite, then I have to be better at something than the average person.
It may make you elite in your mental capabilities, or at least a bit better than the average.

My cat questions everything. Then again, if my cat could talk, she'd probably tell you she's elite. She's certainly alien - the very epitome of the aloof observer and the solitary practitioner.
We do have some thread somewhere on cats being Satanists, so...

Same. Thanks for this.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 08:22:12 pm by Km Anu »

Hapu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2019, 09:54:10 pm »
Same. Thanks for this.

Do you do anything professionally with your art? You could.

IALPRT

  • Guest
Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #12 on: September 24, 2019, 10:35:47 pm »

Still floundering with this, I see.
Quote
So you endorse the skid row bum who claims to be elite because he wears a Baphomet, gives the sign of the horns, and bellows, "Hail Satan!"
Absolutely.
For one, they are far more interesting than your tiresome ilk, whose "kind" I most certainly am not and would not be associated with even if you paid me.

Most importantly, you are and will always be precisely as small as the least of they who perturb you.

Km Anu

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #13 on: September 24, 2019, 10:52:06 pm »
Same. Thanks for this.

Do you do anything professionally with your art? You could.

Thank you Hapu! I don't though. I've only been illustrating for two years and I'm self taught so I dont think I have the requisite skillset.

But I've got some unique abilities that make educational content for children an ideal medium for my skillset, so currently I'm working on that. I'm trying to learn how to animate my character in Adobe CC, and I'm also considering creating a YouTube channel featuring a cast of puppets.

I used to make album covers for soundcloud rappers, but I didnt like the themes I had to illustrate, so I dropped that after a few months. 

idgo

Re: Alien Elite
« Reply #14 on: September 24, 2019, 11:50:10 pm »
...
These are types of humans who are just inexplicably omnicapable. They learn quick. Undifferentiated mastery of things happens at an accelerated rate. Intelligent, physically fit, easy on the eyes, imaginative, focused, competent in any area they are tasked with focusing on, and talented in several - on the whole: "better than you."
...

And although they sometimes do or do not act like it, they know it... and they also know their kind.

Find one of these "omnicapable" people, and ask them whether they think they're particularly bright or special. You may learn that they fail constantly, just not in areas that are visible to you. You may find that the "it" which they know is nothing about themself, but rather of others' perceptions. I've heard it best described in discussing art: One's ability to recognize excellence grows faster than one's ability to produce it. Find a master of any craft, and listen, really listen, as they describe to you what they honestly think about their latest creation. You're far more likely to hear about its flaws and the improvements that it needs, than about its good qualities -- the strengths are taken for granted as obvious, while the weaknesses represent the possibility to improve.

Pay real attention to the individuals you're going around labeling as examples of omnicapability, and you may find that in their own eyes, their work that you think so highly of is rather shit.

Quote
Antinomian - in the sense that, by virtue of a something akin to grace or natural ability, the law simply does not apply.

What law? The laws which people advanced in some field view as governing them may be very different from those which you think apply to your own surroundings, but to the extent that "laws" such as laws of nature are simply descriptors of observed patterns, some law will always apply.

Quote
Either it describes you or it doesn't. If it simply describes the person you'd like to be___ well I've got some disappointing news for you.

Is it actually as simple as observing whether the description applies or not? It's inherently relative, and written from the perspective of someone "incapable" (or one or the Nietzsches, as you call them). To someone who is and has always been "superior", their successes and capabilities wouldn't seem the least inexplicable. It might even take a surprisingly long time for them to ascertain that life is inexplicably more difficult for others than for themself. And yet, if you look around and see others having greater difficulty with similar tasks, is it necessarily logical to conclude that you're one of the √úbermenschen?